MARTIN SIMPSON INTERVIEW - April 8, 2010
A Chat with Mark Egan about Truth Be Told
by Martin Simpson
Mark, you recently sent me a copy of your most recent release, Truth Be Told. I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve had this album in my cd drive and I’ve actually got it playing right now! I’d like to talk to you about this incredible album and give you a platform to explain the work.
M.E. Thanks for listening Martin and glad that you like the new recording. It's great to know that it is getting play in your part of the world.
This is quite a departure from your previous releases and shows you in groove and solo modes. You mentioned in the sleeve notes that it was a lot of fun and THAT is clearly audible – some incredible interaction was happening and you were obviously all coaxing the best performances out of each other weren’t you?
M.E. Truth Be Told is somewhat of a departure for my solo projects. Of the last six solo recordings I feel this recent one is the most intense and powerful project so far. It all has to do with the players and compositions but mostly the players. It was great fun and a very intense three days. Yes, we were all very focused on the interplay between each other and one thing led to another.
All of you have known each other and played together from time to time over the last 28 years but this was the first time that all of you came together as a band – was engineer, Phil Magnotti also ‘hand picked’ for this particular project?
M.E. This was the first time that all of us came together as a band and they were incredible sessions.
Bill and I have played with our group Elements and Bill's bands over the years. I met keyboardist Mitch Forman when I first came to New York in 1976. We've recorded and played live for many years. He now lives in California so we haven't had the chance as much which made this recording a great reunion. I've played live in NY and recorded with Vinnie Colaiuta on Bill's Soul Grass records and I always love his expression on the drums and the hook up that we have. He is a bass players dream in that he grooves so deeply while having extreme flexibility and a creative mind that can take the music anywhere. Percussionist Roger Squitero is also a great player and friend and I added his playing at my studio after the basic recording days. As I lived with the tracks I started to hear the need for percussion.
Phil Magnotti was also hand picked for this project. We have worked together many times over the years on various projects both in New York and in Japan. Phil was the engineer on a CTI record project which was a live audio and DVD video recording. It featured Mike Stern, Dennis Chambers, Mino Cinelu, Randy Brecker and Bob Berg.
The actual recording of Truth Be Told was done in three days at Avatar Studios but how long did the album take from initial conception to final Mastering?
M.E. The concept and compositions for the project were started in January 2009. I spent three months composing and arranging the music. Some of the compositions I had previously written but never recorded on my own records. The music was recorded in New York city during June 15,16,17. We finished post production (keyboard overdubs, bass melodies, sax section overdubs, mixing and mastering in November 2009.
During the entire period I was also quite busy on a worldwide tour with Bill Evan's group Soul Grass as well as the CTI all star band in Europe.
For the preproduction I put together some basic demos that I recorded at my studio as well as charts of all the songs. I spent a great amount of time arranging the songs and doing as much pre production as possible since I knew that we had a lot of music to cover in three days. Most of the decisions for forms, solo orders, tempos and rough timings were done in the pre production phase which made the actual sessions run smoothly. At the sessions we played the songs down for the first time and very shortly after started to record takes. Most of the final takes were the 1st or second takes.
Mitch added some additional keyboard parts on the third day and Bill added some harmony sax parts as well.
Let’s go through the disc track by track and you can tell us what went into each recording, starting with;-
Frog Legs
M.E. Frog Legs is a song that I composed in 1998 and never recorded on my own record. It was recorded on a Lew Soloff record, Raibow Mountain as well as a record with Jeff Ciampa, House of Mirrors. It's a simple funk tune that I thought would be fun in this quartet format. My original bass line was sort of a New Orleans style line but when Vinnie started to play it down I listened closely to his kick drum and came up with a bass line that complemented his pattern. I chose to have the first solo since I wanted the cd to be a bass feature as much as possible in a musical way.
Bill over dubbed a horn section and Mitch overdubbed a few keyboard parts.
Gargoyle
M.E. This song was written by Ron Miller, a great composer from Miami Florida. We have played a lot over the years and Ron was the professor of Jazz Composition at the University of Miami where I studied in the early 1970's.
Ron is a prolific composer and I always wanted to record this song Gargoyle and thought that this group could take it someplace. Again Vinnie was the driving force and this is a great vehicle for Bill Evans to really stretch out on his solo. I like the unison line and it reminds me of a Herbie Hancock/Headhunters style song.
Truth Be Told
M.E. The title track is a song that I wrote for these particular players. It started as a Garage Band demo and then was transfered to MOTU Performer where I wrote the bass melody line and harmony. At the session I played the groove and later overdubbed the melody doubled with the keyboard the first time, then on the repeat Bill Evans doubles it with tenor sax. The bass line is influenced by James Brown and Bootsy Collins in particular.
Sea Saw
M.E. Sea Saw was written a few years ago and I thought that this would be a good vehicle for the band.
We recorded this on the first day, the fifth song of the day which was a lot to accomplish in that amount of time.
This song is more laid back than other songs on the record but I thought that it has a loose feel and would be fun for everyone to improvise over. I extended the end vamp for Vinnie to play over and his solo is amazing..
Cafe Risque
M.E. Cafe Risque is another song that I wrote for this band as a soprano saxophone feature.
The bass line is inspired from an old Maceo Parker record called Maceo and the Kings Men. The bassist is Bernard Odum and I highly recommend all bassist interested in playing funk to give it a listen. It's James Brown band after they had a parting of ways and it is sooo funky. Jaco Pastorius originally told me about it.
There is a middle developmental section that also gives Vinnie some solo space. I played my Pedulla 5 string Fretless on this track and overdubbed another 5 string melody on the bridge of the song.
Shadow Play
M.E. This song was written by Mitch Forman and is a fretless feature. I had heard a CD of a group that Mitch is a member called Metro and they had recorded this song which I thought would be a nice ballad for this record.
I overdubbed and doubled the bass melody as well as the solo. Mitch added some beautiful orchestrations to the track which made it come to life.
Blue Launch
M.E. This is a fun song that I wrote for this session. The head of the song is written around a bass line in 5/4
After the head the eighth note pulse is constant and we go into a shuffle blues with Keyboard and sax solos. At the end of the song Vinnie has another extended solo which he takes over the top.
Rhyme or Reason
M.E. Rhyme or reason was written for the session and was composed on my upright bass. I was playing around and came up with a little snippit of an idea and continued developing it. This is a trio vehicle which leads into a drum and sax improvisation where Bill plays a very inspired solo being fueled by Vinnie's incredible power.
Blue Rain
M.E. Blue Rain is a song that I wrote a year before this session and thought that it would be a nice peice to improvise over. It was inspired by the John Coltrane song, Blue Trane, so this is a play on words, Blue Rain...
This was the first song that we recorded as I thought that it would be a good starting point for the sessions, not too difficult. I recorded a fretted bass on the basic track then overdubbed the solo on my 5 string fretless Pedulla bass.
Pepe'
M.E. Pepe' is a song that I started in 1974 with the bass line to the melody and I never finished the song.
As I was conceptualizing the record I remembered the bass line and added a melody and arranged it for the quartet.
This was a lot of fun to play and was a trio improvisation which ends with another Vinnie drum solo.
I really feel that as much as this record is a bass record I also think that it is the Vinnie record, in a great way. He is so featured and has so much room and is playing so strong........
After Thought
M.E. The concept of After Thought, another play on words, is about the place you reach when you go beyond thinking and you are in a pure mind state. (whatever that is...) It features the 5 string fretless in an indian sort of ambiance. Mitch added great orchestrations to this including the Indian voices (samples). Roger Squitero also played great colors and the Udu drum. The sound of this track is a place that I like to visit as heard on other tracks of my previous recordings.
I have to ask this question – do you have an affinity with the colour Blue? After all, there are two tracks on this album with blue in the title, there’s lots of blues in the sleeve design and you also recorded a track with another friend of mine (Edo Castro) called Blue Asia!!!
M.E. I love the color blue although my favorite color is green, like my Pedulla basses.
There are a lot of Blue colors on the cover and inside of the cd jacket. When I looked at all of the song titles I noticed a lot of the word blue in titles but went with it. Edo Castro is a great friend and bassist and yes, Blue Asia, more Blue.
The cover design was done by Kio Griffith but I’m sure you had a hand in the artwork!!!
M.E. Yes, I usually have input on the artwork since I am releasing these projects on my own label. I prefer to let the graphic designers go and create after I give them a few conceptual ideas. For this cover I wanted to use this photo which is from a tour in Spain in March of 2009 shortly before the recording session. We also tried some abstract graphic ideas but Kio's treatment of the front cover photo was a nice starting point. I supplied him with photos from the session and he came up with the inside art.
I expect at the end of the sessions, you all talked about the possibility of doing a follow up album – when your schedules allow of course!!!
M.E. Yes, everyone wants to get together again and continue where we left off....
Hopefully we can get everyone in the same room for three or four days in a row. It's difficult because all the players are very busy and all over the globe...
You’re quite a prolific composer – on average, how many works do you compose during a year or does it vary widely?
M.E. My composing varies widely. I am always recording ideas when I practice. I have a discman set up in my practice area and often times I start my practice session by just improvising and often come up with ideas that have later become songs. I always like to be working on a new composition and it comes in waves of inspiration. The important thing that I have found is to recognize an idea and to stay with and develope it even if I have no idea what I'll use it for.
I’m sure you’ve already got plans in the pipeline for your next album - is that going to be a Mark Egan solo studio album or something with John Abercrombie or a live album - could you give us a hint?
M.E. At the moment I am thinking about doing another quartet recording with these same players. We only scratched the surface on Truth Be Told...
Thanks for speaking to us Mark.
M.E. Martin, it's my pleasure! All the best, Mark
by Martin Simpson
Mark, you recently sent me a copy of your most recent release, Truth Be Told. I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve had this album in my cd drive and I’ve actually got it playing right now! I’d like to talk to you about this incredible album and give you a platform to explain the work.
M.E. Thanks for listening Martin and glad that you like the new recording. It's great to know that it is getting play in your part of the world.
This is quite a departure from your previous releases and shows you in groove and solo modes. You mentioned in the sleeve notes that it was a lot of fun and THAT is clearly audible – some incredible interaction was happening and you were obviously all coaxing the best performances out of each other weren’t you?
M.E. Truth Be Told is somewhat of a departure for my solo projects. Of the last six solo recordings I feel this recent one is the most intense and powerful project so far. It all has to do with the players and compositions but mostly the players. It was great fun and a very intense three days. Yes, we were all very focused on the interplay between each other and one thing led to another.
All of you have known each other and played together from time to time over the last 28 years but this was the first time that all of you came together as a band – was engineer, Phil Magnotti also ‘hand picked’ for this particular project?
M.E. This was the first time that all of us came together as a band and they were incredible sessions.
Bill and I have played with our group Elements and Bill's bands over the years. I met keyboardist Mitch Forman when I first came to New York in 1976. We've recorded and played live for many years. He now lives in California so we haven't had the chance as much which made this recording a great reunion. I've played live in NY and recorded with Vinnie Colaiuta on Bill's Soul Grass records and I always love his expression on the drums and the hook up that we have. He is a bass players dream in that he grooves so deeply while having extreme flexibility and a creative mind that can take the music anywhere. Percussionist Roger Squitero is also a great player and friend and I added his playing at my studio after the basic recording days. As I lived with the tracks I started to hear the need for percussion.
Phil Magnotti was also hand picked for this project. We have worked together many times over the years on various projects both in New York and in Japan. Phil was the engineer on a CTI record project which was a live audio and DVD video recording. It featured Mike Stern, Dennis Chambers, Mino Cinelu, Randy Brecker and Bob Berg.
The actual recording of Truth Be Told was done in three days at Avatar Studios but how long did the album take from initial conception to final Mastering?
M.E. The concept and compositions for the project were started in January 2009. I spent three months composing and arranging the music. Some of the compositions I had previously written but never recorded on my own records. The music was recorded in New York city during June 15,16,17. We finished post production (keyboard overdubs, bass melodies, sax section overdubs, mixing and mastering in November 2009.
During the entire period I was also quite busy on a worldwide tour with Bill Evan's group Soul Grass as well as the CTI all star band in Europe.
For the preproduction I put together some basic demos that I recorded at my studio as well as charts of all the songs. I spent a great amount of time arranging the songs and doing as much pre production as possible since I knew that we had a lot of music to cover in three days. Most of the decisions for forms, solo orders, tempos and rough timings were done in the pre production phase which made the actual sessions run smoothly. At the sessions we played the songs down for the first time and very shortly after started to record takes. Most of the final takes were the 1st or second takes.
Mitch added some additional keyboard parts on the third day and Bill added some harmony sax parts as well.
Let’s go through the disc track by track and you can tell us what went into each recording, starting with;-
Frog Legs
M.E. Frog Legs is a song that I composed in 1998 and never recorded on my own record. It was recorded on a Lew Soloff record, Raibow Mountain as well as a record with Jeff Ciampa, House of Mirrors. It's a simple funk tune that I thought would be fun in this quartet format. My original bass line was sort of a New Orleans style line but when Vinnie started to play it down I listened closely to his kick drum and came up with a bass line that complemented his pattern. I chose to have the first solo since I wanted the cd to be a bass feature as much as possible in a musical way.
Bill over dubbed a horn section and Mitch overdubbed a few keyboard parts.
Gargoyle
M.E. This song was written by Ron Miller, a great composer from Miami Florida. We have played a lot over the years and Ron was the professor of Jazz Composition at the University of Miami where I studied in the early 1970's.
Ron is a prolific composer and I always wanted to record this song Gargoyle and thought that this group could take it someplace. Again Vinnie was the driving force and this is a great vehicle for Bill Evans to really stretch out on his solo. I like the unison line and it reminds me of a Herbie Hancock/Headhunters style song.
Truth Be Told
M.E. The title track is a song that I wrote for these particular players. It started as a Garage Band demo and then was transfered to MOTU Performer where I wrote the bass melody line and harmony. At the session I played the groove and later overdubbed the melody doubled with the keyboard the first time, then on the repeat Bill Evans doubles it with tenor sax. The bass line is influenced by James Brown and Bootsy Collins in particular.
Sea Saw
M.E. Sea Saw was written a few years ago and I thought that this would be a good vehicle for the band.
We recorded this on the first day, the fifth song of the day which was a lot to accomplish in that amount of time.
This song is more laid back than other songs on the record but I thought that it has a loose feel and would be fun for everyone to improvise over. I extended the end vamp for Vinnie to play over and his solo is amazing..
Cafe Risque
M.E. Cafe Risque is another song that I wrote for this band as a soprano saxophone feature.
The bass line is inspired from an old Maceo Parker record called Maceo and the Kings Men. The bassist is Bernard Odum and I highly recommend all bassist interested in playing funk to give it a listen. It's James Brown band after they had a parting of ways and it is sooo funky. Jaco Pastorius originally told me about it.
There is a middle developmental section that also gives Vinnie some solo space. I played my Pedulla 5 string Fretless on this track and overdubbed another 5 string melody on the bridge of the song.
Shadow Play
M.E. This song was written by Mitch Forman and is a fretless feature. I had heard a CD of a group that Mitch is a member called Metro and they had recorded this song which I thought would be a nice ballad for this record.
I overdubbed and doubled the bass melody as well as the solo. Mitch added some beautiful orchestrations to the track which made it come to life.
Blue Launch
M.E. This is a fun song that I wrote for this session. The head of the song is written around a bass line in 5/4
After the head the eighth note pulse is constant and we go into a shuffle blues with Keyboard and sax solos. At the end of the song Vinnie has another extended solo which he takes over the top.
Rhyme or Reason
M.E. Rhyme or reason was written for the session and was composed on my upright bass. I was playing around and came up with a little snippit of an idea and continued developing it. This is a trio vehicle which leads into a drum and sax improvisation where Bill plays a very inspired solo being fueled by Vinnie's incredible power.
Blue Rain
M.E. Blue Rain is a song that I wrote a year before this session and thought that it would be a nice peice to improvise over. It was inspired by the John Coltrane song, Blue Trane, so this is a play on words, Blue Rain...
This was the first song that we recorded as I thought that it would be a good starting point for the sessions, not too difficult. I recorded a fretted bass on the basic track then overdubbed the solo on my 5 string fretless Pedulla bass.
Pepe'
M.E. Pepe' is a song that I started in 1974 with the bass line to the melody and I never finished the song.
As I was conceptualizing the record I remembered the bass line and added a melody and arranged it for the quartet.
This was a lot of fun to play and was a trio improvisation which ends with another Vinnie drum solo.
I really feel that as much as this record is a bass record I also think that it is the Vinnie record, in a great way. He is so featured and has so much room and is playing so strong........
After Thought
M.E. The concept of After Thought, another play on words, is about the place you reach when you go beyond thinking and you are in a pure mind state. (whatever that is...) It features the 5 string fretless in an indian sort of ambiance. Mitch added great orchestrations to this including the Indian voices (samples). Roger Squitero also played great colors and the Udu drum. The sound of this track is a place that I like to visit as heard on other tracks of my previous recordings.
I have to ask this question – do you have an affinity with the colour Blue? After all, there are two tracks on this album with blue in the title, there’s lots of blues in the sleeve design and you also recorded a track with another friend of mine (Edo Castro) called Blue Asia!!!
M.E. I love the color blue although my favorite color is green, like my Pedulla basses.
There are a lot of Blue colors on the cover and inside of the cd jacket. When I looked at all of the song titles I noticed a lot of the word blue in titles but went with it. Edo Castro is a great friend and bassist and yes, Blue Asia, more Blue.
The cover design was done by Kio Griffith but I’m sure you had a hand in the artwork!!!
M.E. Yes, I usually have input on the artwork since I am releasing these projects on my own label. I prefer to let the graphic designers go and create after I give them a few conceptual ideas. For this cover I wanted to use this photo which is from a tour in Spain in March of 2009 shortly before the recording session. We also tried some abstract graphic ideas but Kio's treatment of the front cover photo was a nice starting point. I supplied him with photos from the session and he came up with the inside art.
I expect at the end of the sessions, you all talked about the possibility of doing a follow up album – when your schedules allow of course!!!
M.E. Yes, everyone wants to get together again and continue where we left off....
Hopefully we can get everyone in the same room for three or four days in a row. It's difficult because all the players are very busy and all over the globe...
You’re quite a prolific composer – on average, how many works do you compose during a year or does it vary widely?
M.E. My composing varies widely. I am always recording ideas when I practice. I have a discman set up in my practice area and often times I start my practice session by just improvising and often come up with ideas that have later become songs. I always like to be working on a new composition and it comes in waves of inspiration. The important thing that I have found is to recognize an idea and to stay with and develope it even if I have no idea what I'll use it for.
I’m sure you’ve already got plans in the pipeline for your next album - is that going to be a Mark Egan solo studio album or something with John Abercrombie or a live album - could you give us a hint?
M.E. At the moment I am thinking about doing another quartet recording with these same players. We only scratched the surface on Truth Be Told...
Thanks for speaking to us Mark.
M.E. Martin, it's my pleasure! All the best, Mark